Humanist Discussion Group, Vol. 37, No. 101.
        Department of Digital Humanities, University of Cologne
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    [1]    From: Fishwick, Paul <Paul.Fishwick@utdallas.edu>
           Subject: Re: [Humanist] 37.98: that thesis (66)

    [2]    From: David Zeitlyn <david.zeitlyn@anthro.ox.ac.uk>
           Subject: Re: [Humanist] 37.100: that thesis (7)


--[1]------------------------------------------------------------------------
        Date: 2023-06-13 17:12:01+00:00
        From: Fishwick, Paul <Paul.Fishwick@utdallas.edu>
        Subject: Re: [Humanist] 37.98: that thesis

Dear Willard:

You discussed--------------

“So, Paul's most welcome rejoinder: "What about the essential
contribution of humanities to computing?" What indeed. If we're talking
about computing as a kind of engineering, then wouldn't answers come
from asking that very question of older forms of engineering? This would
send me to the likes of Walter Vincenti and Eugene Ferguson, and to
historian Mike Mahoney. If a kind of architecture, then, among others,
those listed by Neil Leach in Rethinking Architecture (1997) or to
Annabel Jane Wharton's Architectural Agents: The Delusional, Abusive,
Addictive Lives of Buildings (2015). Oddly enough the question gets
easier with the hugely difficult application of computing to modelling
intelligence.

But I am just thrashing around here. I think Paul could answer his own
question better than I, or others here deeper into the technical side of
computing than I've ever been.”

My response---------------

On the connection between computer science and the humanities, 
or more generally, science & engineering and the humanities, I have 
one question and
and one response.

I am still needing to understand the apparent concern within the 
humanities on efforts to expand research along the lines of the 
digital (e.g. digital humanities and digital arts). I would think that 
acceptance within the traditional humanities would continue to be 
on the rise. Is this not so? Is there really a good case to be made 
for doing without the digital humanities and humanities computing?

As to how the humanities can help computing, there are many 
possibilities. The first is the introduction of philosophy. Ethics with 
respect to AI has taken the media by storm, and so Ethics is one 
subject needed to make its way into computer science. But, this is 
the tip of the iceberg. Philosophy, in general, should be a requirement:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outline_of_philosophy

Another major concern of mine is that computer science is obsessive 
about utility. There is little question that coding and the use of the 
technology is key; however, this centrality has come at the expense 
of computer scientists forgetting that it is the theory (‘mathematics’ 
for CS) that is also central. My 3 month stay at Exeter in the UK had 
me wandering everywhere to find computer science, operations 
research, and STEM. I ended up giving a public lecture at the local 
museum. Consider the beautiful medieval Exeter bridge. Not only is 
this of historical and cultural significance, but also, mathematics, 
computer science, and operations research can be found in this 
structure. Mathematics is a way of thinking about the bridge.

Unfortunately, this mode of thought is too uncommon. The focus on 
computer science (applied mathematics) is imagined to be solely 
for engineering and technological utility. What if computer science 
could be a “way of thinking and interpreting?” Then, the bridge 
serves as an object of diverse learning and reflection. Philosophy 
trumps utility. I want to code like everyone else, but I place more 
emphasis on the CS theory because through this theory, we can 
re-engage with our humanities colleagues. 

-paul



--[2]------------------------------------------------------------------------
        Date: 2023-06-13 07:24:11+00:00
        From: David Zeitlyn <david.zeitlyn@anthro.ox.ac.uk>
        Subject: Re: [Humanist] 37.100: that thesis

For readers unfamiliar with Graham M. Jones's work part of the interest
is that his doctoral work was the ethnographic study of magic - stage
magicians in Paris!

best wishes

david


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